North Vs. Extreme timeline and other things
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Re: North Vs. Extreme timeline and other things
whaat?? i think you misread me someplace... i am not saying my 2 submarines are capable of destroying you entirely.. i am saying that if we spent the damages over the 3 days, you would have lost all your submarines... and i would probably have lost those 2 submarines... mainly because i would have been able to bring my air power on your position before you are able to even know where i am !i posted what i thought were fair responses with realistic damages and now your saying my whole force should be under
i could drop mines/torpedoes on your ship before you see my first surface ship... and then once that happens, you got more torpedoes and depth charges from the destroyers!
the advantage of a submarine lies in the fact that its stealthy and has the element of surprise... you lost both of these advantages!
Yes. That's what I have been saying. My 2 submarines are going to be out or destroyed.i will give you credit for knowing your submarine counter measures yet countermeasures are only so effective and i feel i must push for both of your involved submarines from being out of the remainder of the conflict. be they destroyed or just crippled beyond combat readiness.
Ok, let me clear this up for you:
Andreas said that you and I should just post what happened in 3 days worth of battle. I told him, that if we were to do that, then I would ask for all your submarines destroyed/massive damage(rendered useless), in exchange for the two submarines(destroyed/rendered useless). The reason for such damages being that you have lost the advantages of a submarine unit while i have the advantage of an air unit.
I told Andreas that you obviously wouldn't accept such a result, and thus, I didn't bother asking you if you want to do a 3 day battle damage post. Mostly because you could probably come up with some strategy/tactic to counter me effectively, maybe even destroying my entire unit. And thus, to achieve that, we'd have to continue posting the way we do. In other words, I am giving you the chance to destroy more of my units, but your allies want to do a 3-day battle post damage type thing. And I am not going to give anything more than 2 submarines for your all submarines because I got a few strategies/tactics/plans in store to take out your submarines!
Thus, I am coming half way and saying, "lets battle it out as we are currently doing. it may destroy your units.. or it may destroy mine! But at least we wouldn't just randomly accept damages!"
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Re: North Vs. Extreme timeline and other things
Two things:
I didn't say you should necessarily take damages for three days. I said you should take damage for the battle. I'm not entirely sure what you're used to, but in most wars the rest of the war isn't paused in diplomacy and waiting for a week for the main characters to finally post the backstory needed to finish it. Most battles don't drag out beyond two responses and if disputes drag on more than a day or two, and you're getting into serious minutiae of detail, that's the time to give up, just agree some reasonable damages and get on with the war. Believe me, I've got into such fights and had a lot more types of units involved doing a lot more specific attacks. It's not worth the time to try and work out the fine details second by second.
EDIT: Though if North does have time and the desire to have a blow-by-blow battle with you I'm not stopping him. Just try and get it sorted within, say, two days please? Or by whenever the Omen is about to destroy Nova Kajar, whichever comes later.
The second (and the reason I expect your destroyers would be so easy for 25000 points of submarines to take down) is that they don't have depth-charges - or if they do, they only have a few, and certainly not enough to annihilate 25000 points of subs without taking very, very serious damage. In your orbat, the one you insisted on not defining, you have "Type 45 Destroyer (air defence)". I don't know a great deal about destroyers but I do know they're suited to different roles and you need to declare the customisation if it has one. Eg I have two AA, one anti-sub and one really good at firing missiles long range. While they each have probably very basic capabilities in all areas, I don't expect my AA one, for example, to be much good against subs, or my guided missile one to be useful against fighters.
Well, you said yours were (air defence). When you made comments about them being good against North's subs, I looked them up. When I hear you mention depth-charges, my suspicions are confirmed. Wikipedia, the ultimate recwar reference for units only referred to by a standard name, has this to say about their anti-sub capabilities.
This is why if you want specific stuff, you define the unit beforehand.
I didn't say you should necessarily take damages for three days. I said you should take damage for the battle. I'm not entirely sure what you're used to, but in most wars the rest of the war isn't paused in diplomacy and waiting for a week for the main characters to finally post the backstory needed to finish it. Most battles don't drag out beyond two responses and if disputes drag on more than a day or two, and you're getting into serious minutiae of detail, that's the time to give up, just agree some reasonable damages and get on with the war. Believe me, I've got into such fights and had a lot more types of units involved doing a lot more specific attacks. It's not worth the time to try and work out the fine details second by second.
EDIT: Though if North does have time and the desire to have a blow-by-blow battle with you I'm not stopping him. Just try and get it sorted within, say, two days please? Or by whenever the Omen is about to destroy Nova Kajar, whichever comes later.
The second (and the reason I expect your destroyers would be so easy for 25000 points of submarines to take down) is that they don't have depth-charges - or if they do, they only have a few, and certainly not enough to annihilate 25000 points of subs without taking very, very serious damage. In your orbat, the one you insisted on not defining, you have "Type 45 Destroyer (air defence)". I don't know a great deal about destroyers but I do know they're suited to different roles and you need to declare the customisation if it has one. Eg I have two AA, one anti-sub and one really good at firing missiles long range. While they each have probably very basic capabilities in all areas, I don't expect my AA one, for example, to be much good against subs, or my guided missile one to be useful against fighters.
Well, you said yours were (air defence). When you made comments about them being good against North's subs, I looked them up. When I hear you mention depth-charges, my suspicions are confirmed. Wikipedia, the ultimate recwar reference for units only referred to by a standard name, has this to say about their anti-sub capabilities.
You have sonar. And you have a single helicopter per ship with a couple depth charges and/or homing torpedos each. Hardly enough to easily destroy that many submarines as easily as you seem to be suggesting.* Anti-submarine
o MFS 7000 sonar
o The embarked Lynx HMA 8 helicopter or Merlin HM1 helicopter is capable of carrying Sting Ray torpedo. The Merlin HM1 helicopter is fitted with its own dipping sonar and carries sonobuoys.
This is why if you want specific stuff, you define the unit beforehand.
Andreas
"He showed up three or four years ago and accidentally took over the micronational world by being way more competent and enthusiastic than everyone else. Now he sort of rules us all, but it's a benevolent sort of thing, as far as we know."
~Scott Alexander
"He showed up three or four years ago and accidentally took over the micronational world by being way more competent and enthusiastic than everyone else. Now he sort of rules us all, but it's a benevolent sort of thing, as far as we know."
~Scott Alexander
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Re: North Vs. Extreme timeline and other things
yes subs use stealth but that doesn't mean they cant duke it out
as andreas said to attack a submarine effectively you need highly specified weapons and equipment which granted you have to some extent but my orbat is 70% dedicated to attacking naval targets ie ships how much of your orbat is dedicated to attacking submarines?
i mean when you were writing up your force what were you thinking? i was thinking im going to sink anything on the water that isn't my ally.
and as for surprise yes you now know im in the ocean... but the ocean is big deep and wide. knowing there's poison ivy in the woods doesn't mean you don't accidentally touch it.
as andreas said to attack a submarine effectively you need highly specified weapons and equipment which granted you have to some extent but my orbat is 70% dedicated to attacking naval targets ie ships how much of your orbat is dedicated to attacking submarines?
i mean when you were writing up your force what were you thinking? i was thinking im going to sink anything on the water that isn't my ally.
and as for surprise yes you now know im in the ocean... but the ocean is big deep and wide. knowing there's poison ivy in the woods doesn't mean you don't accidentally touch it.