Insignia
Insignia
It's about time I got around to doing this. Before I fill out the form, I feel this requires introduction. Since this is first in a potential series of requests, subsuquent ones will be more brief.
Uantirian Aristocratic Titles need unique insignia that can be put in signatures and leaderhead or worn on clothing to identify their position. When I left for the Army my friend donated an old Macbook of his to me so I'd have something to fiddle around on while in AIT (the part of initial training where I was allowed access to electronic devices on the weekend.) He's a graphics designer and his laptop came brimming with awesome programs like Adobe Photosop, Illustrator, Corel Draw, Quark, &tc. I have failed to master them, and my attempts at free hand are, well, laughable. So I am interested to see what the College of Arms can manage for me. Though Uantir has many titles, I am going to start with one of the more basic titles, also the one that is most relevant to traditional heraldry: the title of Knight or Dame. Though I do not have the most concrete idea of what I want, I'm banking on the fact that the illustrators will appreciate freedom of artistic license over feeling like an image mill.
NAME: Ailin, Ari Ryan
TITLE IN MICRONATION: King
MICRONATION: The Kingdom of Uantir
MACRONATION: The United States of America
EMAIL: Uantir@Gmail.com
WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE IN YOUR ARMS?: Here we go. First off, I would like the charge to be in the shape of a 14th century shield I want to use the national colors, but I don't know if I want to use all three. I am wishy on the base color, but I think we'll start with argent. That's sort of where I draw the end of my specifics. I want there to be a male and female version, but similar enought that they are clearly variations of the same insignia. I am trying to stay away from another animal, as that will make it far too confusing with the national crest and colors of Uantir. It also has to have the capacity to feel part of a progression. As the badges increase in title, they will have more and more of the national colors, I think. The insignia will build off of this one and whatever is designed for the Thane / Thaness to create the Baron(ess) and Count(ess) insignias. It by no means needs to be as progressive as, say, rockers and chevrons like advancing in rank in the US Army, but I want there to be a distinguishable progression. On the other symbols I am much more comfortable straying from the strict path of heraldry, but not for the Knight / Dame. I'm thinking a mullet of three points maybe? If the field will inevitably be tierced pallwise, the top point would have to be centered on the vertical axis. Otherwise it'd look weird. I'm thinking the color of the star would be the (for now) gender difference. Not sure which colors though.
Uantirian Aristocratic Titles need unique insignia that can be put in signatures and leaderhead or worn on clothing to identify their position. When I left for the Army my friend donated an old Macbook of his to me so I'd have something to fiddle around on while in AIT (the part of initial training where I was allowed access to electronic devices on the weekend.) He's a graphics designer and his laptop came brimming with awesome programs like Adobe Photosop, Illustrator, Corel Draw, Quark, &tc. I have failed to master them, and my attempts at free hand are, well, laughable. So I am interested to see what the College of Arms can manage for me. Though Uantir has many titles, I am going to start with one of the more basic titles, also the one that is most relevant to traditional heraldry: the title of Knight or Dame. Though I do not have the most concrete idea of what I want, I'm banking on the fact that the illustrators will appreciate freedom of artistic license over feeling like an image mill.
NAME: Ailin, Ari Ryan
TITLE IN MICRONATION: King
MICRONATION: The Kingdom of Uantir
MACRONATION: The United States of America
EMAIL: Uantir@Gmail.com
WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE IN YOUR ARMS?: Here we go. First off, I would like the charge to be in the shape of a 14th century shield I want to use the national colors, but I don't know if I want to use all three. I am wishy on the base color, but I think we'll start with argent. That's sort of where I draw the end of my specifics. I want there to be a male and female version, but similar enought that they are clearly variations of the same insignia. I am trying to stay away from another animal, as that will make it far too confusing with the national crest and colors of Uantir. It also has to have the capacity to feel part of a progression. As the badges increase in title, they will have more and more of the national colors, I think. The insignia will build off of this one and whatever is designed for the Thane / Thaness to create the Baron(ess) and Count(ess) insignias. It by no means needs to be as progressive as, say, rockers and chevrons like advancing in rank in the US Army, but I want there to be a distinguishable progression. On the other symbols I am much more comfortable straying from the strict path of heraldry, but not for the Knight / Dame. I'm thinking a mullet of three points maybe? If the field will inevitably be tierced pallwise, the top point would have to be centered on the vertical axis. Otherwise it'd look weird. I'm thinking the color of the star would be the (for now) gender difference. Not sure which colors though.
His Incomparable Highness,
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
Re: Insignia
You're basically asking me to develop you a heraldic standard. I am not opposed to helping but I strongly urge you to look here for heraldic insignia. Saves us from reinventing the wheel, something I, to be honest, do not have the time and energy for atm. We can obviously make some alterations and color changes to suit Uantir.
But let me get this straight, you want heraldic-esque badges to denote the rank and title of a citizen? Most often this is done with coronets and crowns (see link provided) put above their own style of arms. I.e a simple knight usually has only a torse or band, while a Count will have band with mounted pearls. Higher ranks employ leaf designs (usually some form of strawberry leaf) or pearls mounted upon long tines or some such. However, we can make Uantirian heraldry a little more unique by using such badges of rank (as you've requested) placed center-field akin to [img=http://lib.normark-mn.co.cc/images/8/84/JohanICOA.png]my own arms[/img] as Grand King of Normark. The crest in the center is the arms of the House of Einhorn, whereas the arms in back is my own personal arms. So for Uantir we place the personal arms as the large shield and the arms of rank in the center or visa versa depending on your own personal preference (I find it necissary to establish some kind of heraldic law, I did it in Normark after finding that some kind of heraldic standard is necissary if you're going to have extensive heraldry).
But let me get this straight, you want heraldic-esque badges to denote the rank and title of a citizen? Most often this is done with coronets and crowns (see link provided) put above their own style of arms. I.e a simple knight usually has only a torse or band, while a Count will have band with mounted pearls. Higher ranks employ leaf designs (usually some form of strawberry leaf) or pearls mounted upon long tines or some such. However, we can make Uantirian heraldry a little more unique by using such badges of rank (as you've requested) placed center-field akin to [img=http://lib.normark-mn.co.cc/images/8/84/JohanICOA.png]my own arms[/img] as Grand King of Normark. The crest in the center is the arms of the House of Einhorn, whereas the arms in back is my own personal arms. So for Uantir we place the personal arms as the large shield and the arms of rank in the center or visa versa depending on your own personal preference (I find it necissary to establish some kind of heraldic law, I did it in Normark after finding that some kind of heraldic standard is necissary if you're going to have extensive heraldry).
Click to register your team!
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Re: Insignia
Yes, I am. I understand what you're saying, but noone in Uantir is interested in heraldry but me. If I have Aristocrats that want to make personal arms someday, bringing out the strawberry leaves and such will make sense.
What I need isn't personal arms or national arms, but title arms. They need to stand independent of everything else, which is why I titled this thread Insignia. I need a unique symbol to identify the Title while following the rules of traditional heraldry. It's important for the Medieval Title chain to follow the rules of traditional heraldry.
What I want is something that looks like this (I changed my mind about the mullet, using it as the pallwise border) except polished up and even. I've toyed around trying to make it look neat and such, but I'm never very happy with it. I know that there's talent here better suited to make it look less like a crayon on the wall drawing and more like a respectable peace of imagery.
And I can't decide what's the best way to make a gender distinction. Perhaps shrinking the mullet and putting a symbol at each point, something masculine and something feminine? Or would color work? The problem with color is that over time colors change, there was a time when pink (since deep red dyes didn't exist) was a vibrant masculine color and we all know purple can stand for royalty as well as being a female color. Same thing happens to symbols, but there are far more to choose from.
What I need isn't personal arms or national arms, but title arms. They need to stand independent of everything else, which is why I titled this thread Insignia. I need a unique symbol to identify the Title while following the rules of traditional heraldry. It's important for the Medieval Title chain to follow the rules of traditional heraldry.
What I want is something that looks like this (I changed my mind about the mullet, using it as the pallwise border) except polished up and even. I've toyed around trying to make it look neat and such, but I'm never very happy with it. I know that there's talent here better suited to make it look less like a crayon on the wall drawing and more like a respectable peace of imagery.
And I can't decide what's the best way to make a gender distinction. Perhaps shrinking the mullet and putting a symbol at each point, something masculine and something feminine? Or would color work? The problem with color is that over time colors change, there was a time when pink (since deep red dyes didn't exist) was a vibrant masculine color and we all know purple can stand for royalty as well as being a female color. Same thing happens to symbols, but there are far more to choose from.
His Incomparable Highness,
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
Re: Insignia
I understand that, they're not so much arms as badges of rank to be put into a CoA for your citizenry. But to clarify gender distinction, men are given shield designs whereas woman are almost always given a lozenge shaped (see #4) design. As such, your male citizens would use a shield design while your female citizens would use a lozenge design. I'll need a complete list of titles from you, so that I can make the appropriate number.What I need isn't personal arms or national arms, but title arms. They need to stand independent of everything else, which is why I titled this thread Insignia. I need a unique symbol to identify the Title while following the rules of traditional heraldry. It's important for the Medieval Title chain to follow the rules of traditional heraldry.
Click to register your team!
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Re: Insignia
Hmm. That could work, a lozenge for the females. Would the three point star looks as well inside the lozenge?
You want to work on all the titles now? Not all of them are in heraldic style and I don't have a concrete idea of what I want for all of them yet. I was going to go one at a time. Mostly out of respect for you, I feel bad about subjecting you to project overload. Also because (as you will see below) they build off each other and I'd like to have the 'foundations' solid before moving on. Plus I know you've got Jess's request pending as well. Plus, as I said, only the Knight and Dame are really heraldry dependent. Everything else is just insignia. I'll give you the master list anyway, but I'm only requesting the Knight / Dame ones right now. All but the Celtic progression need a male and female variation.
-Knight / Dame (we've already discussed)
-Thane(ss): No idea. In the Medieval style of course, but with a much more sword and sorcery, fantasy feel to it. Reminiscent of heraldic style, but no conformity necessary.
-Baron(ess): It really depends on what happens with the Thane(ss) device. The 'career path' of the Thane(ss) and Knight/Dame lead to the Baron(ess) title. Thus it would make sense to make it look like a combination of those two, while at the same time being 'fancier' and not just a mash up. Regardless of what the Thane(ss) comes out like I'd like to keep the shield and lozenge.
-Count(ess): An upgrade on the Baron(ess) device, I'd like to include another color to the field, probably black, somehow. Perhaps add something outside the shield and lozenge like a border of some kind, wreaths or flames or something (female and male?)
-Prince(ss): Is the royal ascension of the 'Medieval' title progression. Thus it will include the lion in it, and the field would be all three colors in the same way the national colors do. The lion in the space above the intersection of the top two points of the star, in the head of the device, would work nicely in addition to whatever else is happening.
-Chieftain(ess): This is the 'ancient Celtic tribal' title progression. Celtic knot work will be the centerpiece here, perhaps the trinity knot (similar to the Knight / Dame star!) or something round. Being the most insignia-esque of them all, it needs no field and can easily be set on any background, or made as a lapel pin etc.
-Con(ess): The same design as above, but with the addition of an oak leaf tangled up in it at the center.
-(Ban)Tiarna: Same as above, but fancier, expanded knot work.
-Ri(gan): Like the Prince(ss) this is another royal rank, and needs the winged lion in it somewhere. Instead of an oak leaf, it would be one of those knot work Celtic Tree of Life symbols, perhaps with the lion set on the trunk.
-Lord / Lady: These designs I've had the most trouble with. The title progression is designed after the Regency / Victorian / Romantic Art period 'enlightened' style aristocracy feel. I really have no idea what to put on it at all. Which means I have no real way of defining the Regent(ess) either. This is also the only 'incomplete' title progression, as the Regent(ess) doesn't really lead into anything of its own style, but into the Count(ess) and (Ban)Tiarna.
You want to work on all the titles now? Not all of them are in heraldic style and I don't have a concrete idea of what I want for all of them yet. I was going to go one at a time. Mostly out of respect for you, I feel bad about subjecting you to project overload. Also because (as you will see below) they build off each other and I'd like to have the 'foundations' solid before moving on. Plus I know you've got Jess's request pending as well. Plus, as I said, only the Knight and Dame are really heraldry dependent. Everything else is just insignia. I'll give you the master list anyway, but I'm only requesting the Knight / Dame ones right now. All but the Celtic progression need a male and female variation.
-Knight / Dame (we've already discussed)
-Thane(ss): No idea. In the Medieval style of course, but with a much more sword and sorcery, fantasy feel to it. Reminiscent of heraldic style, but no conformity necessary.
-Baron(ess): It really depends on what happens with the Thane(ss) device. The 'career path' of the Thane(ss) and Knight/Dame lead to the Baron(ess) title. Thus it would make sense to make it look like a combination of those two, while at the same time being 'fancier' and not just a mash up. Regardless of what the Thane(ss) comes out like I'd like to keep the shield and lozenge.
-Count(ess): An upgrade on the Baron(ess) device, I'd like to include another color to the field, probably black, somehow. Perhaps add something outside the shield and lozenge like a border of some kind, wreaths or flames or something (female and male?)
-Prince(ss): Is the royal ascension of the 'Medieval' title progression. Thus it will include the lion in it, and the field would be all three colors in the same way the national colors do. The lion in the space above the intersection of the top two points of the star, in the head of the device, would work nicely in addition to whatever else is happening.
-Chieftain(ess): This is the 'ancient Celtic tribal' title progression. Celtic knot work will be the centerpiece here, perhaps the trinity knot (similar to the Knight / Dame star!) or something round. Being the most insignia-esque of them all, it needs no field and can easily be set on any background, or made as a lapel pin etc.
-Con(ess): The same design as above, but with the addition of an oak leaf tangled up in it at the center.
-(Ban)Tiarna: Same as above, but fancier, expanded knot work.
-Ri(gan): Like the Prince(ss) this is another royal rank, and needs the winged lion in it somewhere. Instead of an oak leaf, it would be one of those knot work Celtic Tree of Life symbols, perhaps with the lion set on the trunk.
-Lord / Lady: These designs I've had the most trouble with. The title progression is designed after the Regency / Victorian / Romantic Art period 'enlightened' style aristocracy feel. I really have no idea what to put on it at all. Which means I have no real way of defining the Regent(ess) either. This is also the only 'incomplete' title progression, as the Regent(ess) doesn't really lead into anything of its own style, but into the Count(ess) and (Ban)Tiarna.
His Incomparable Highness,
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
Re: Insignia
Ja it should work, They would have to be vertically arranged and/or considerably smaller. As far as doing them all now, I will do each one as I have time, moving down the list for you, as this is going to be a bit of a long term project. I will begin working on the Knight/Dame stuff later today.
Click to register your team!
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Re: Insignia
Thanks.
His Incomparable Highness,
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
Re: Insignia
Click to register your team!
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Re: Insignia
That's excellent!! It's so even, in the color and in the scale. I would never have pulled of the lozenge.
I'm excited. I may change the star's color to either the brown that's currently on the Uantir Lion's mane, or a more distinct bronze. I know that brown is not a traditional heraldic color, but we're already breaking the metallic on metallic rule anyway. The background I can fill in to be all grey, except I'm not quite sure how to not fill in all the black borders as grey when filling in the black field. There wont be more than one until the next highest title I think. Either way, fills are things I (should) be able to do without too much trouble.
This is great amounts of greatness.
I'm excited. I may change the star's color to either the brown that's currently on the Uantir Lion's mane, or a more distinct bronze. I know that brown is not a traditional heraldic color, but we're already breaking the metallic on metallic rule anyway. The background I can fill in to be all grey, except I'm not quite sure how to not fill in all the black borders as grey when filling in the black field. There wont be more than one until the next highest title I think. Either way, fills are things I (should) be able to do without too much trouble.
This is great amounts of greatness.
His Incomparable Highness,
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
Re: Insignia
Thanks . If you have Photoshop CS2 or later, I could probably just e-mail you the PSD and you can recolor accordingly.
Click to register your team!
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Re: Insignia
I have a cracked version of CS3. That might make thing easier, yes.
His Incomparable Highness,
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
Re: Insignia
One of the last things I'd openly admit on a public forum, but alright lol. PM me your e-mail, as it isn't on your forum profile.
Click to register your team!
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Re: Insignia
I made preperations for the inevitable clash between me and the Adobe Licensing Secret Police. That and it's only cracked because I am using my friend's CD key after he upgraded. I downloaded the software from the internet, sure, but the product was paid for, just not by me.
Uantir@gmail.com
Uantir@gmail.com
His Incomparable Highness,
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
Re: Insignia
I don't think they can do much then, as the license has been paid for and was physically given to you. Also, sent!
Click to register your team!
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Tarjei Einhornsson - Grand Marshal of The Nordic Union
Zand Gozâr - Grand Vizier & Satrap of Kumarastan, Kingdom of Babkha
Re: Insignia
His Incomparable Highness,
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir
His Matchless Grace,
His Majestic Honor,
His Eminent Splendor,
His Chivalrous Eminence,
The Rook
Lord Protector of Uantir