[BAT] removal discussion
Moderator: Staff
Re: [BAT] removal discussion
You're being a bit hypocritical here. At first you say it's straw-clutching, but then you cite strict adherence to the rules.
If you want to follow strict adherence to the rules, then Jack may have issued a resignation of citizenship, but since no government body is present to recognize or process that request, he still has the opportunity to withdraw or nullify it and maintain his citizenship in Batavia, and thereby issue a removal order to the MCS. A historical parallel can be drawn from the Battle of San Jacinto. Santa Anna was captured by Texans and signed a treaty recognizing Texas' independence. But the treaty was never ratified by the Mexican government and therefore never recognized by Mexico. It didn't matter what Santa Anna said, it mattered what the government said. Similarly, Jack's emigration was never recognized by the Batavian government, and he can withdraw the statement because of that and retain his citizenship.
I realize this is a loophole, but if you want to follow things strictly then it is what it is.
If you want to follow strict adherence to the rules, then Jack may have issued a resignation of citizenship, but since no government body is present to recognize or process that request, he still has the opportunity to withdraw or nullify it and maintain his citizenship in Batavia, and thereby issue a removal order to the MCS. A historical parallel can be drawn from the Battle of San Jacinto. Santa Anna was captured by Texans and signed a treaty recognizing Texas' independence. But the treaty was never ratified by the Mexican government and therefore never recognized by Mexico. It didn't matter what Santa Anna said, it mattered what the government said. Similarly, Jack's emigration was never recognized by the Batavian government, and he can withdraw the statement because of that and retain his citizenship.
I realize this is a loophole, but if you want to follow things strictly then it is what it is.
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Re: [BAT] removal discussion
Not really. Jack's straw-clutching is at rules that don't exist. Unless Batavia has stated somewhere that any citizenship revocations need to be confirmed by their government - which, if they have, I'd happily like to see it - then the standard convention among micronations since, well, before I even joined is that if someone announces they're leaving a nation, they've left. Given that Jack has so adamantly been stating he is no longer a Batavian citizen (hence why we're in this predicament), the only hypocrisy is on his side with him now trying to say he is a Batavian citizen. With that insistence of him not being a Batavian, my adherence to the rules by not allowing him to secede from Batavia is not hypocritical in the slightest, regardless of what "loopholes" are now trying to be created...Orion wrote:You're being a bit hypocritical here. At first you say it's straw-clutching, but then you cite strict adherence to the rules.
Re: [BAT] removal discussion
The loopholery would make some difference, but not a lot, because even if now Jack could withdraw his citizenship revocation, he would still have to wait the month's grace period for Batavia to be removed, and also for the Brettish Isles to reach 60 days of age. As Craitman pointed out, though, without further evidence it would really be bending the rules significantly, creating a bad precedent in favour of one nation.
Formerly His Imperial Niftiness Yardistanislaus du Grifos, former Kaiser of Shireroth
Now just Vilhelm Benkern, Count of Mar Sara
Suzerain of Hawshire // Peil̊åkti an Ixraǔtn | Protector of the Safir // Xonuti Shawa 'allumi Sanilla'i'i | King of the Free State of Sanilla
Now just Vilhelm Benkern, Count of Mar Sara
Suzerain of Hawshire // Peil̊åkti an Ixraǔtn | Protector of the Safir // Xonuti Shawa 'allumi Sanilla'i'i | King of the Free State of Sanilla
Re: [BAT] removal discussion
for the record, I did not say that i am still a batavian citizen. I was only pointing out something. and let it be clear that it would only be great if Batavia would be online again because I am sure that arrangements can be made. the problem is that i can't reach Gustaaf. also, I only care about the brettish isles, the mainland of batavia could be inactive till eternity if it were up to me.
Porque las estirpes condenadas a cien años de soledad no tenían una segunda oportunidad sobre la tierra.